Hi guys, I have been skating for just over a year now, and got into slalom about 4 months ago. I got my first setup (skaterbuilt hs conekiller, bennett 4.3 and skandal on mixed zigs) secondhand about 3 months ago. It is nice for running through some tight courses (what I mainly do so far) but I think a more dedicated tight board would help. I have redrilled the board back onto the tail, and then the same distance back on the nose (to give me the power off the kicktail, with the same wb) I have cut down and sphericalised the bennett (85mm spaceable to original 109mm) but the deck still feels too narrow at the rear (only 5.5" wide at the tail and I have size uk 12s). I am thinking about buying a lynn kramer pro model and putting my cut down bennett and skandal on there. I also have some bits and bobs lying about to put on the skaterbuilt (bennett 5.0 and randal 125/35 I can cut down both to 110 ish) for more gs / hybrid. I also have 8 70mm zigs in 83 (4) - 86 (2) - 89 (2) which could go on both boards. I am not likely to get the lynn kramer until christmas if I do, and I reckon that by then I would be more deserving of a better board.
To summarise, will a more dedicated ts deck help me learn faster at ts than a hybrid deck?
Second board.
Moderator: Karl Floitgraf
Second board.
Last edited by Joe Boyle on Sat Oct 16, 2010 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Donald Campbell
- Pavel
- Posts: 2036
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- Location: germany
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joe,are you skating with the other brighton boys or just on your own?
i think you could get all the answers from your skatebuddies then.
also just buying a different board again will not really help you improve your racing style.
practice will improve your style though.
looks like you are on a shopping spree.
i think you could get all the answers from your skatebuddies then.
also just buying a different board again will not really help you improve your racing style.
practice will improve your style though.
looks like you are on a shopping spree.
I am skating with the other brighton guys, and making it to events whenever I can, but I don't know of anyone else with the deck I am looking at. Most of the decks people ride here are twice the price of the decks I am looking at, and however lovely the concave and overall feel and quality of the pirnack is I am not likely to be able to afford one (or properly use one) in the near future. I have been getting advice from some of the guys at the sessions, and I can feel a notable improvement with each and every session. I just think that a wider tailed deck, with a slightly shorter wheelbase will help me learn and improve, just like it did when I put the spherical in my bennett, and just like it did when I cut down the bennett. Part of the reason I am posting here is that as winter closes in, fewer and fewer sessions have been happening, and fewer and fewer people are regularly turning up. I hope to make it up to london on the 30th of this month, and I will see if I can try an axe. I will also be able to ask Michael at octane his opinion, as he is the guy selling them. I have some cones arriving at some point so my practice can go from every other week, to at least twice a week, and that should make a world of difference.
alright, I think I'm gonna stick with my hybrid deck for the moment, hopefully get to try the other deck out in a few weeks and see whether or not I even like it. I have a pps foam kit coming in a few weeks, so I'm gonna put some concave on the tail and see if that helps me lock in and get the leverage I am craving.
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Jonathan Harms
- JBH - ISSA Treasurer
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2003 2:00 am
- Location: St. Louis, MO
Joe, my overall answer to whether you should get a board specifically for TS is "maybe."
It depends on several factors, mainly how long your wheelbase is, how tight the courses you usually ride are, and how big your feet are.
ConeKiller HS
Overall: 8.75" x 32.5"
Wheelbases: 19.5" to 21"
The wheelbase (inner hole to inner hole) on your ConeKiller can go from 19.5" to 21". For some people, the 19.5" is short enough for TS. But if you're riding relatively flat courses, your cone spacing is probably pretty tight (< 6 feet between centers), and that board may end up feeling a little big and sluggish.
One other thing that may be affecting your performance (in addition to perhaps just continuing to practice, as Donald recommends) is your big ol' honkin' feet.
It could be that the Skaterbuilt is just too narrow where your feet actually contact it to give you proper leverage. If you angle your feet forward quite a bit, it will probably work just fine. But if you have a more surfy stance (feet across the board), your feet will not be well supported, as the CK gets pretty narrow there. I used to think a narrower board and/or very narrow trucks meant a better TS board, but in the end I found that a wider board and trucks (about the size you have) gave more leverage, which resulted in an easier (and thus quicker) turn.
Kramer (forgive my bad Photoshop outline/cut)
Overall dimensions: 31" x 8 3/8" (7" tapered tail width)
Wheelbases: 18.625" and 19.625"
The Kramer model puts a bit more "meat" where your feet are likely to be, and it has a shorter wheelbase option. So my guess is it would feel a little more secure underfoot and give you a better/quicker feel.
That said, you might even consider an even wider board, something like the Fullbag "Junk in the Trunk" TS model:
This would put even a bit more width under your feet than the Kramer. But alas, only you can tell how much is enough or too much. Note: Fullbag boards have a mellower tail kick than either the CK or the Axe boards. It's a bit more of a pocket than a kicktail. But they are top quality, just as the Skaterbuilt and Axe boards are.
Bottom line: Try to work with what you've got, and if you have any friends who ride wider boards with short-ish wheelbases, try every one you can and see what fits your style best.
Hope that helps.
It depends on several factors, mainly how long your wheelbase is, how tight the courses you usually ride are, and how big your feet are.
ConeKiller HS
Overall: 8.75" x 32.5"
Wheelbases: 19.5" to 21"
The wheelbase (inner hole to inner hole) on your ConeKiller can go from 19.5" to 21". For some people, the 19.5" is short enough for TS. But if you're riding relatively flat courses, your cone spacing is probably pretty tight (< 6 feet between centers), and that board may end up feeling a little big and sluggish.
One other thing that may be affecting your performance (in addition to perhaps just continuing to practice, as Donald recommends) is your big ol' honkin' feet.
It could be that the Skaterbuilt is just too narrow where your feet actually contact it to give you proper leverage. If you angle your feet forward quite a bit, it will probably work just fine. But if you have a more surfy stance (feet across the board), your feet will not be well supported, as the CK gets pretty narrow there. I used to think a narrower board and/or very narrow trucks meant a better TS board, but in the end I found that a wider board and trucks (about the size you have) gave more leverage, which resulted in an easier (and thus quicker) turn. Kramer (forgive my bad Photoshop outline/cut)
Overall dimensions: 31" x 8 3/8" (7" tapered tail width)
Wheelbases: 18.625" and 19.625"
The Kramer model puts a bit more "meat" where your feet are likely to be, and it has a shorter wheelbase option. So my guess is it would feel a little more secure underfoot and give you a better/quicker feel.
That said, you might even consider an even wider board, something like the Fullbag "Junk in the Trunk" TS model:
This would put even a bit more width under your feet than the Kramer. But alas, only you can tell how much is enough or too much. Note: Fullbag boards have a mellower tail kick than either the CK or the Axe boards. It's a bit more of a pocket than a kicktail. But they are top quality, just as the Skaterbuilt and Axe boards are.
Bottom line: Try to work with what you've got, and if you have any friends who ride wider boards with short-ish wheelbases, try every one you can and see what fits your style best.
Hope that helps.
You described my problem perfectly, the deck feels big and sluggish through the <6" offsets, I have redrilled the wheelbase 2.5" back on both trucks at the shortest wb, giving me plenty of space in the front, but 5.5" in the back. at the moment I have to angle my foot around 70 degrees forward, which is uncomfortable and unnatural to me. I will most likely get an axe at some point and tune it for very tight courses, and use the conekiller for looser courses and more commute and cruise friendly (wider trucks, longer wheelbase, softer wheels etc). My cones arrived yesterday, but I haven't had a chance to skate yet, but hopefully tomorrow night could work 
. All the courses I would run in practices are 6 foot or less with up to 12" off sets on flat ground, so a short wheelbase and torsional stiffness are necessary. I had a look at the jitt, but it is just too difficult to get hold of in the UK. I have tried a few pavels, and a gecko, as well as a quick spin on the axe. I loved the feel of the foamies, but I can't really remember the axe, as it was quite a while ago. The pirnack felt the best to me, but I would like something with slightly more angle in the kick. I also have a pps foam to buy in about a month, so I will add some concave to the kick of both the skaterbuilt and the axe, a feature i liked on the pavel.
EDIT: I ran it through some cones earlier tonight, it was straight with 4.5-5.5' centres, which would be a pretty typical course for me to run. The conekiller felt a bit sluggish and slow, but that was probably just me. I might film a few of my next runs to watch my technique and time myself. I did notice I was mainly hitting toeside cones with my back toes, and I hit a few on the other side with my front heel. I'm pretty sure it's a technique problem, but i do feel better on a wider deck.
ANOTHER EDIT: went out today with my brother timing me and I got 9.34 raw time on 30 cones (5 foot centres) on flat. It was 10.34 with cone penalties, but I don't think that is too shabby. I drew an approximate centre line from heel to toe, then measured it against the centre of the deck, and it was near 10 degrees from parallel! I can't really drive from the back, and it feels like my back foot is only there to keep some weight on the rear wheels, no driving or pumping my leg and it feels very awkward. I think I might 'need' this new deck after all hehe
. All the courses I would run in practices are 6 foot or less with up to 12" off sets on flat ground, so a short wheelbase and torsional stiffness are necessary. I had a look at the jitt, but it is just too difficult to get hold of in the UK. I have tried a few pavels, and a gecko, as well as a quick spin on the axe. I loved the feel of the foamies, but I can't really remember the axe, as it was quite a while ago. The pirnack felt the best to me, but I would like something with slightly more angle in the kick. I also have a pps foam to buy in about a month, so I will add some concave to the kick of both the skaterbuilt and the axe, a feature i liked on the pavel.EDIT: I ran it through some cones earlier tonight, it was straight with 4.5-5.5' centres, which would be a pretty typical course for me to run. The conekiller felt a bit sluggish and slow, but that was probably just me
. I might film a few of my next runs to watch my technique and time myself. I did notice I was mainly hitting toeside cones with my back toes, and I hit a few on the other side with my front heel. I'm pretty sure it's a technique problem, but i do feel better on a wider deck.ANOTHER EDIT: went out today with my brother timing me and I got 9.34 raw time on 30 cones (5 foot centres) on flat. It was 10.34 with cone penalties, but I don't think that is too shabby. I drew an approximate centre line from heel to toe, then measured it against the centre of the deck, and it was near 10 degrees from parallel! I can't really drive from the back, and it feels like my back foot is only there to keep some weight on the rear wheels, no driving or pumping my leg and it feels very awkward. I think I might 'need' this new deck after all hehe