[2006] Region East Atlantic: Europe

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:10 am

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Tue Jan 24, 2006 10:04 am

Sure there are some less good things that Jadranko and others may have pointed out but so there will always be. Most important is that we take them into account. And that we have. So for example even if I agree that France having two Main statuses is not ideal there are other reasons weighing it up this time.

If there is take somthing into account, some things had changed. But anyway....

Corky, we want to candidate with our Race in Zurich (end of September) for a prime status.

/J-Rad

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Tue Jan 24, 2006 1:54 pm

Jadranko, I have updated you as a candidate for one of the 2 Primes remaining.

Looking at the event and the field of last years 80-cone race it sure is a good candidate for a Prime status.

Detlef Rehbock · Post by **Detlef Rehbock** » Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:05 am

hi corky,

as an organizer of a slalom race i can´t understand that you dindn´t decide about donalds request for a prime status.

the race is in less than three months. if you decide that donald didn´t get a prime, than say it.
if he get the status, let him know. it´s important to know that. i think he can´t wait for that answer. if i ask next year fora main status, i need the answer soon. not a few weeks before.

it´s an argument for sponsors. it´s important to know.
so make your decision.

now.

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:08 pm

So, every one was fighting for a good status.

But who is working on somthing ?

May PARIS no information, no website (presentation), no registration

June Hannover World Cup, information from last year, registration from last year

July Brixlegg no definitive information, website under construction (presentation), no registration

July RIGA no definitive information, website isn't updated, no registration

September ANTIBES no information, no website, no registration

The question is:

What is professional and what isn't ?
Does it metter if you have your race in the countryside or in a city ?
What do you understand under promoting an event ?

some questions, some discussions, some blablabla

read the whole topic again.....

This is my personal summary what we talked about in the past 3-4 months.

This (above) is the Fact why we need an organisation body, guidlines, rules and so on

/J-Rad

some talk, some work, some do both

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:02 pm

maybe ddorf is not so important to get a prime?
we easily have more spectators than grüni-see g.o.g. pics.

maybe i used the wrong hairspray?
maybe corky just forgot it?

who knows?

thanx for the support,dete!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:11 pm

It depends where you host your race. see pics from over 80 cones

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Fri Feb 17, 2006 12:48 am

Detlef Rehbock wrote:as an organizer of a slalom race i can´t understand that you dindn´t decide about donalds request for a prime status.

the race is in less than three months. if you decide that donald didn´t get a prime, than say it.
if he get the status, let him know. it´s important to know that. i think he can´t wait for that answer. if i ask next year fora main status, i need the answer soon. not a few weeks before.

it´s an argument for sponsors. it´s important to know.
so make your decision.

now.

The European racers decide not me. When the time limit is out the status is gone. It should be decided before and it is much up to the organizer to talk for it and for racers to support it.

The latest you will know if you get a Main status is 3 months before the event. This is a minimum limit. Depending on how good you push for getting a status it can be long before that. For example see the current 2006 table above with Prime/Main/Major status this year for Paris, Hannover, Grüningen, Riga, Brixlegg and Antibes. Only 2 Primes left.

Time limit for getting a Prime status ran out on "Great Western Race Series #1" February 2. So in a sense it has been decided since a long time ago that it will not get Prime status.

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:49 am

corky

i'm not gonna comment on your decision,maybe i will do my next race in a garage though to get a prime?
getting a prime for the great western was a fact for all of us,there didn't seem to be the need for discussion.

if it's not you to decide,but the racers,then do yourself a favor and change it to a prime.
i don't want to recruit all the racers to this forum to start a discussion.

it's that easy,why make things complicated?

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 11:23 am

getting a prime for the great western was a fact for all of us,there didn't seem to be the need for discussion.

who is all ? there were 3 races for two left prime statuses...

if it's not you to decide,but the racers,then do yourself a favor and change it to a prime.

racers mean the whole region.
the whole region is Europe.

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:16 pm

thanks for sharing your thoughts,jadr.

i don't need your oppinion here,you'rejust trying to make me look like a fool,that's it.
if you don't plan to attend the race,keep your smart comments for yourself.
as we see it, there are a few europeans coming,even from switzerland.

do i have to give you a detailed names-list to get your approval?

concentrate on your events and keep out of this discussion.

Steve Hinzen · Post by **Steve Hinzen** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:25 pm

Topic Europe / European races, Oct 27th, 2005, Donald Campbell wrote:

as there are two open prime slots for germany we would like to announce 2 races for the next year one slated for april2nd in cologne and one for october 8th in düsseldorf as the "great western race series".
if i don't see anybody else stepping up for a race we will take the 2 primes for germany.
besides that we DO have sponsors for our races,namely US.
please feel free to correct me if there are any mistakes

Topic world ranking / region east Atlantic, January 10th, 2006, Hans Koraeus wrote:

There are also still 2 more Prime statuses that have not been discussed much. Don seems to have no problem taking care of them but I know Stockholm is interested in one of those Primes as well. And I still hope England could surprise us with something. Prime need to be decided 2 months ahead so for an early season opener the earliest date possible is know March 10. Time is running away quickly...

Topic world ranking / region east atlantic, January 10th, 2006, Steve Hinzen wrote:

If no one else enters into competition for primes the great Western Series should get prime status. We need to know this until the 2nd of february. This is exactly 2 month ahead of the first of the two races.

Corky,

We all know you are doing great job with Your World Ranking System.
But from my point of view you are doing a formal mistake by denying a prime status fort the Great Western Race Series. You explain there has to be a discussion about the status for every competition. You are not talking about the character of this discussion needed to lead to a proper decision.
Remember, Corky, that there was an open proposition from the organizers of the GWRS.
And: there was nobody opposing and nobody talking against the organizer’s demand.

No opposition means agreement.
It’s as simple as that.

I guess the status for last year’s Stockholm race was decided under the same format, wasn’t it?

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:34 pm

This Forum is about the statuses.

We want a prime too for our race in Zurich. So every organizer is here at the right place.

You know how does it work here.
1 person = 1 voice

concentrate on your events and keep out of this discussion.

our event's are more or less ready to run...
your regi isn't already on the net. I would change the text which was wrote on Feb. 13

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:42 pm

"we want a prime for zürich"

that's why you are involved,thanks for sharing.

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:55 pm

on a side note:
zürich and grüningen are very close -20-30kms?
isn't it unfair to have 2 prime races in the same city/suburb spread during a season?

you could go and argue that hannover and düsseldorf are in the same country.
but we do have aprrox.350 kms between the 2 venues.

so there's a big difference between those two major cities and your situation.
you got your share for this year,that's why i would definitely vote againsta second prime for the same area.

since my race will be the season opener for germany,i can plan with a healthy group of entrants.
my race will have racers from france,switzerland,england as guests,that should be enough for getting a prime status,don't you think?

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:59 pm

24. of january

Corky, we want to candidate with our Race in Zurich (end of September) for a prime status.

3 races for 2 statuses.
We know the race in Stockholm and it's starterfield, we know it region (north)
We know the race in Zurich and it's starterfield, we know it region (middle)

If we look to the region, than it's between Cologne and Zurich.

We know the two months rule.
2nd of February was the deadline. It wasn't promote (or did i missed the information somewhere) and it wasn't decided here.

That are the rules...

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:15 pm

isn't it unfair to have 2 prime races in the same city/suburb spread during a season?

Is it fair to have two mains in the same country and there aren't already information about both events ?

There are many unfair things here, but we have to live with it...

Competition in Zurich:
Look at the starterlist from last year, it will have for shure more the next year. We plan to have the best Tight-Slalom rider in Zurich next year and are looking with the organiseres (city of Zurich) of the car free day to be the highlight of the whole event. That means more coverages in magazins/newspapers/tv than you can dream...

Peter Klang · Post by **Peter Klang** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:30 pm

Get real guy’s, why all the hostility? Stockholm did get it’s status fair and square, if anyone had problem with that, talk to Freud. Stockholm don’t care about status 2006, if we get bellow basic in the ISSA ranking who cares. We will do it cuz we love it. We just had a race this last weekend, fun formate with Macster as the winner, all good all fun. To mess with the lot of you here is the status for the 2006 European races.

Major
Paris
Riga
Brixlegg

Main
Antibes
Hannover
Gruningen
London

Prime
All others

Kiss me first
PK

Etienne de Bary · Post by **Etienne de Bary** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:49 pm

Donald Campbell wrote:on a side note:
zürich and grüningen are very close -20-30kms?
isn't it unfair to have 2 prime races in the same city/suburb spread during a season?

if you count the share of German-Swiss girls in the ranking, it's a bit like these suburbs cover half the planet...

(on the other hand Steve's argument seems to make sense to me as far as i do understand... doesn't it sound like this status thing has actually been discussed and approved in time, though in a somewhat implicit manner ?)

Steve Hinzen · Post by **Steve Hinzen** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 4:08 pm

Topic world ranking / region east Atlantic, Sept 08, 2005, Hans Koraeus wrote:

But even though right now the only proposal is from Klang and Marcus there is a need for more information about the event to be able to adorse such a status or not.

Topic world ranking / region east Atlantic, Oct 10, 2005, Hans Koraeus wrote:

Ok, the time is running out. No other candidate than Stockholm for the two Prime statuses that Europe has left. And no protests either. So then it's settled. Stockholm get Prime status. There is still one left but it looks like Stockholm will be the last race of the year with a respectable status. A last chance for you who have not competed enough this year.

... in between these posts there was no further discussion, no further information about the race...

Don't get me wrong, Corky.
I have no problem with your last year's decision about Stockholm (at least another prime was safed for european racers) as long as you treat every race organizer and respect their demands in the same way.

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Thu Feb 23, 2006 2:59 pm

let's make this easy and fast to overlook for each and everybody
issa-voters will give their voices for the race.
then we are playing by any given rule and this whole deal is official.
corky has to accept the decision then.
here's my take on the situation:
i can easily get 19 votes for germany,who is against that,who also has the power to vote?

besides that,absolutely correct observation of facts,steve!

Chris Eggers · Post by **Chris Eggers** » Thu Feb 23, 2006 3:28 pm

I agree, this is a classic thing that has to be decided by an official body.

Let´s vote, Corky, open up the vote post..........I suggest...........

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:02 am

Corky wrote on October 10. that the time is out and Stockholm is setted.

It was exactly 2 months before the competition and the situation was 1 race for two open primes.

Now we had from the 24. of january 3 candidates for 2 open primes.

If you look at the rules of the slalomranking.com website than it's very clear that the Great Western race will not get a prime.

For the voting. The organisation isn't running already. The World Ranking comes from corky, not from the issa Forum members who take over the Forum. The Ranking has it's owen rules, which are listed on the slalomranking website.

/J-Rad

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:10 am

Topic world ranking / region east Atlantic, January 10th, 2006, Hans Koraeus wrote:
Quote:
There are also still 2 more Prime statuses that have not been discussed much. Don seems to have no problem taking care of them but I know Stockholm is interested in one of those Primes as well. And I still hope England could surprise us with something. Prime need to be decided 2 months ahead so for an early season opener the earliest date possible is know March 10. Time is running away quickly...

Topic world ranking / region east atlantic, January 10th, 2006, Steve Hinzen wrote:
Quote:
If no one else enters into competition for primes the great Western Series should get prime status. We need to know this until the 2nd of february. This is exactly 2 month ahead of the first of the two races.

Topic world ranking / region east atlantic, January 24th, 2006, Jadranko Radovanovic wrote:
Corky, we want to candidate with our Race in Zurich (end of September) for a prime status.

No, discussions until February 13th.

are those the Facts or not ?

/J-Rad

Steve Hinzen · Post by **Steve Hinzen** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:21 am

If you look at the rules of the slalomranking.com website than it's very clear that the Great Western race will not get a prime.

Bullshit! Jadranko, you're totally missinterpretating this thing. As you can read above I have asked for a decision about the status long before the deadline for the GWRS. If the master of the ranking or anybody else does not answer within time, why should this be the race organizer's problem?

Yes, Jadranko, it's not about voting,
it's about Corky to take a stand now.

Now, stop boring me, Jadranko!

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:48 am

Jadranko Radovanovic wrote:The World Ranking comes from Corky, not from the ISSA Forum members who take over the Forum. The Ranking has it's own rules, which are listed on the slalomranking website.

/J-Rad

You are always trying to bend the things to fit in your scheme, aint that so, jadranko?
at this young age you show the same tendencies, the old German organization from the seventies and eighties had. This organization passed away sooner or later, since all the skaters didn't like the way it has been run.

Why is it that you are trying to undermine our race,each and every way possible here on the net?
Which benefit does this bring to you?
Maybe you take your time and quote me again, after you have done so, a clear answer is due.

Pat Chewning · Post by **Pat Chewning** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 10:57 am

I agree (with someone) that the process does seem a bit messed up. Somewhat similar to what happened in USA East Coast:

1) A race was cancelled, someone made a post about another race obtaining the cancelled race status (I believe within the deadline).
2) No decision/action from the deciding body by the deadline.
3) Further requests, demands, universal agreement among the region that the proposed race SHOULD get the status from the cancelled race.
4) Answer is "NO, too late, past deadline".

Result: 2005 East Coast lost a status and never recovered.

I really think the process could be improved like this:
1) MAJOR status races must have a formal written proposal within some (very long) deadline, with a decision made by some (long) leadtime. Very similar to to the way it is done now, but a set date for yearly proposals due and a set date for yearly decisions. (e.g. Proposals written and submitted by 30 January. Decision by 30 February. Earliest MAJOR June 15)

2) MAIN status races must have a formal written proposal with some (long) deadline, with a decision made by some (medium) leadtime. Similar story (set calendar deadline for proposal and decision). (e.g. Proposals by 30 February Decision by 30 March. Earliest race by 30APRIL)

3) PRIME status races must have an informal posted proposal within 2 months of the race. If the race meets some minimum standard (TBD), then it is PRIME. There can be as many PRIME races as there are months in the year. PRIME statuses can be decided up to 4 weeks before the race (the deadline for a decision). Notice that there can be as many as one PRIME race per month (as long as it meets the minimum standard).

4) BASIC status races can be anounced 1 week in advance. They automatically receive BASIC status.

We should put our big selection/decision efforts into the MAIN and MAJOR races, and streamline the decision process and allow more PRIME races. I think that would solve a lot of problems.

That doesn't solve the immediate problem (unless Corky acts quickly and allows more PRIME races....), but it might help out for next year.

--Pat

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 11:55 am

Don and Steve,

the answer is very easy.

There are rules on slalomranking.com
http://www.slalomranking.com/rules/?ses ... 1a79d7a41a

Steve asked on the 10 of January if there are others who want the prime too.

Yes there are others:

Zurich
Stockholm
Cologne

There was no reaction after my post from 24 of January from the organizers site of the cologne race. You knew realy good the deadline of the 2nd of February. The announcement for the race came on February 3rd on ss.com. It was announced in october for this Date, but without info.

you are always trying to bend the things to fit in your scheme,aint that so,jadranko?
at this young age you show the same tendencies,the old german organization from the seventies and eighties had.
this organization passed away sooner or later,since all the skaters didn't like the way it has been run.

There are rules (not setted by me). We all have to fallow this rules. It's not my problem if you don't read the rules. What you are doing with your short proposals to change the setted rules is what i see as fitting the things in your scheme.

If i'm wrong, please tell me where my fault is or where i interpret the rules in a wrong way.

I'm not intereseted what happened to the german organisation but as you know we have to share the statuses between the organisers in Europe. The rules are needed that all know what the prozess is. When i analyse our race in Zurich with the given rules/criterias, than i must say, yes we deserve a prime status for this race.

why is it that you are trying to undermine our race,each and every way possible here on the net?
which benefit does this bring to you?
maybe you take your time and quote me again,after you have done so,a clear answer is due.

It has nothing to do with you or your race. There are two primes left for 3 races. What i'am doing is the same thing what you do. We candidate with our race for one of this statuses.

I told you the arguments why (because of the rules) your race shouldn't get the prime.
If the rules are here to regulate the things than we have to take them in account. If we don't take them in account we will have many diffrent worldrankings. The most important thing is to develop the rules together, what will be done by an official organisation (ISSA).

Is this answer clear enough ?

/J-Rad

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:02 pm

ok so steve will give you a proposal in a few mins,j-rad.

something about the rules,you so easily accept,my thoughts on that subject:

there was no existing body of members,who constituted those "rules".

most of the "rules" are to be viewed as suggestions,to say so.
that's what you are referring to,there is absolutely nobody who can or will enforce those rules,because there is no solid base for the rules in question

if you set up a ranking system like the one in existance,you have a certain responsibility to the community which is eyeing at the system.
this responsibility may be a burden sometimes,but the prime directive has to be that the creator of the system should be present in any discussion regarding status or anything else referring to the system.,be it whatever,in our case ,status for a race,without doing so,the system loses its credibility and it also shows its weaknesses.

coming to corky and the role he's playing in the system.
it would be absolutely perfect,if he just keeps programming and updating the site.
all major decisions should not be only done by him,they should be done by an existing issa.

we all know that some of the decisions which have been made in the recent past are questionable and also i see that pat chewning is tending to go to the same direction i proposed a few months ago,regarding prime statuses and their seeding.

it is high time that any rule any of us are referring to gets sanctioned by an existing,governing body.until then,there are no real rules.
you should know that,jadranko,whenever you refer to those rules.

i do not want to shed a bad light on anything either jani or corky did.
but it seems that we should all be in for a reality check.

Steve Hinzen · Post by **Steve Hinzen** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:08 pm

Pat, thanx for your creative suggestions for next year. I guess, this is something Corky should think about.

In order to stop your constant hassling, Jadranko, i have a suggestion for this year's prime candidates:

There is no problem for the GWRS in April to step back from a prime status. The race will be great anyway. A lot of great racers have announced their coming. Most of them don't give a damn about points and ranking....

We, the organizers of the GWR-Series, have something cool to offer:
our second race of the series in Octobre as a "backup"-race for a prime status.
As I said before, we are not in urge for this status.

Our suggestion will give the chance to other attractive races, which might want to candidate a little bit later for different reasons, for example "Brands-Hatch". This is defintely a race which might deserve a prime to make the season more interesting.

I propose that the Zurich-race steps up with the same kind of offer as we do.
Jadranko, it's not about following some rules, it's about creating a great european racing season.

Ramón Königshausen · Post by **Ramón Königshausen** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:53 pm

Sorry, this is almost smarty-pants boy stuff but it has to be done:

Steve Hinzen wrote:Jadranko, it's not about following some rules, it's about creating a great european racing season.

rmn

Dominik Kowalski · Post by **Dominik Kowalski** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 7:59 pm

FXCK THE RULES - GO SKATE!

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:43 pm

We, the organizers of the GWR-Series, have something cool to offer:
our second race of the series in Octobre as a "backup"-race for a prime status.
As I said before, we are not in urge for this status.

Our suggestion will give the chance to other attractive races, which might want to candidate a little bit later for different reasons, for example "Brands-Hatch". This is defintely a race which might deserve a prime to make the season more interesting.

I propose that the Zurich-race steps up with the same kind of offer as we do.

As we see now: tow races for two Prime statuses.

The date for the Zurich race is setted. And the information about the race are on the slalom-series.ch website.

Stockholm, no further information yet.

I don't understand your offer or for what it should be. I don't know which kind of offer do you want from us.

We candidated for a prime status and are now waiting what will happen.

Jadranko, it's not about following some rules, it's about creating a great European racing season.

Does it change anything on the great season if we fallow the rules for the world ranking statuses ?

The rules are here for the statuses of the races.
And that are official rules which are published on the slalomranking.com site. The website explain why it's needed and how does it work.

At the moment that is the only ranking which we have. There isn't an official body now which analyse and change the rules except the developer of the rules. Corky takes the inputs of the racers/organiser in account, but in the end he has to follow the rules which he published. Corky explain on the webiste how it works and what the rules are.

That is how it is now.

FXCK THE RULES - GO SKATE!

what a statement...

/J-Rad

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:50 pm

j-rad
which rules?
who enforces those rules?
which organization created those rules?
are they legit and sanctioned by any existing body that has been elected by whom?

you won't be able to come up with a decent answer to those questions,unless you are plain stupid.

see,corky created a ranking system on his own.the rules posted on his site reflect his or janis thoughts on how things should be handled,that's the way it is,no denying that.

most of these rules are sort of quality benchmarks as far as i see it.

stepping back from the demand of a prime status means that we want to give brands hatch a chance.
you should do the same,if you want to act as a real sportsman,anything else would only show your selfishness on this whole debate.

since your zürich race is such a great and exciting race,why the need for a prime status anyway?
will it change the number of spectators watching the race?
what's your benefit?

so domink says the he doesn't care about the rules,damn right.

what a great season is ahead of us this year,oh my god i am so happy.
some nice contests in switzerland in some scenic(that's a bit over the top,but hey,i gotta give you a break) small villages nobody ever heard of-i am counting the days and i'm so anxious...

get a grip on reality man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

all i see in your posts is that you want the most for what you do,always pointing at the "rules" you so blindly obey and never hestitate to citate.
it's not only the rules,j-rad.
skateboarding is different than that but you must have slept the day away on that info.

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 1:18 pm

The organisation (ISSA) is not running yet, it will need some time. But i'm sure the slalomranking will be included in the ISSA. Then it will be official running by an official organisation

The ranking is the only we have now. It doesn't depend on who created it or who did the rules. When the rules are defined, then you have to follow them, whether you like it or not.
If it doesnt change anything, why do you want a prime for your first race when you want to give Brands Hatch a chance ?

Brands Hatch isn't sure. Chris Linford wrote in the ncdsa.com Forum:

It is easy for us to travel to Europe than to host an event here. I see no reason why we should have an event here when it is not supported.

I don't know what happen in Uk, but I didn't see any announcement or information.

Our race is in September, so we have enough time for the decision.

since your zürich race is such a great and exciting race, why the need for a prime status anyway?
will it change the number of spectators watching the race?
what's your benefit?

Those from Switzerland who don't travel to the big races have a chance to earn some point's for the ranking. That's the only reason.

What's your benefit ?

/J-Rad

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 8:21 pm

Jadranko Radovanovic wrote:The organisation (ISSA) is not running yet, it will need some time. But i'm shure the slalomranking will be included in the ISSA. Than it will be official running by an official organisation

The ranking is the only we have now. It don't depands by who it is created or who did the rules. When the rules are setted, than you have to follow them, if you like it or not.
If it doesnt change anything, why do you wanted a prime for your first race when you want to give brands hatch a chance ?

Brands Hatch isn't shure. Chris Linford wrote in the ncdsa.com Forum:
It is easy for us to travel to europe than to host an event here. I se no reason why we should have an event here when it is not supported.
I don't no what happen in Uk, but i didn't saw any announcement or information.

Our race is in September, so we have enough time for the decision.

since your zürich race is such a great and exciting race,why the need for a prime status anyway?
will it change the number of spectators watching the race?
what's your benefit?
Those from Switzerland who don't travel to the big races have a chance to earn some point's for the ranking. That's the only reason.

What's your benefit ?

/J-Rad

damn i have to quote your whole pamphlet,because the nonsense starts with the first word and ends with the last.
incredible stuff you are writing there,jadranko,absolutely incredible.

please do us all a favor and post this stuff on ncdsa and we all will have some hearty laughs.

let the americans rejoice in such classic statements as "When the rules are setted, than you have to follow them, if you like it or not".
or show our british friends why there should be no support for their attempt to organize a race .
what you just showed us is absolutely incredible....thanks again man.

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 9:06 pm

no answer on my question ?

the discussion is about the the two last prime statuses.

The Fact is that if you want a status of this slalomranking you have to follow the published rules.

let the americans rejoice in such classic statements as "When the rules are setted, than you have to follow them, if you like it or not".
or show our british friends why there should be no support for their attempt to organize a race .

1. What will happen if we have no rules, how should the statuses be setted ? Should every organiser decide by him slef which status he should have ?

2. as i say before, i don't know what happens in Uk. It was a statement from Chris Linford not from me. what i say is that there are no more information about a race in uk and that we have enough time for a decison.

You are censorious agains't all rules, but you have no other proposal. How it should be decided when we don't follow the rules ?

In our situation here:

corky

i'm not gonna comment on your decision,maybe i will do my next race in a garage though to get a prime?
getting a prime for the great western was a fact for all of us,there didn't seem to be the need for discussion.

if it's not you to decide,but the racers,then do yourself a favor and change it to a prime.
i don't want to recruit all the racers to this forum to start a discussion.

it's that easy,why make things complicated?

It's not about me and the rules. Check your posts what you wrote.

Do we have so many rules ?

Ramón Königshausen · Post by **Ramón Königshausen** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:23 pm

Jadranko Radovanovic wrote:no answer on my question ?
1. What will happen if we have no rules, how should the statuses be setted ? Should every organiser decide by him slef which status he should have ?

What is all the tragedy about? Like I mentioned before: While you are caring about statuses, organisation and all that stuff, others may worry about sales on our stuff and ask themselves who might be the next generation, the next compeditior or even the next slalomskateboard-owner.
What is so important to have such a status? It looks like the only joyful thing for you about slalomskateboarding is to gain points and compete with others on that, sorry corky, stupid world ranking. Are those points important for your existence or what?
In my eyes the only thing you got to know is whether an event is considered big or not.

just my comment on that...

rmn

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 12:31 am

Oops, sorry but I have been too busy latley.

2005 December 10 Prime in Stockholm
It was a very special situation with two Primes left for the season and no events wanting them. If it would have been early on in the season it would have been another thing.

2004 April 2 Prime
It was announced very early (Oct 2005) but then in Cologne. On Feb 3rd it was re-announced with a new location in Dusseldorf. Strictly to the rules 1 day too late but we are not that strict. I have been slow to act on this and since there has been no other candidates showing up and Stockholm taking a step back I propose that Dusseledorf and Zurich take the two last Primes.

This means that all the Primes are gone for this season but... why not.

Any protest on this?

Peter Klang · Post by **Peter Klang** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:54 am

Stockholm taking a step back????????????????????
Wake up Corky, I spoke personaly with you just two days ago.
I feel I just maybe do something soon... This has to become more professional.
If ISSA don´t act, somebody else will.

/PK

Jadranko Radovanovic · Post by **Jadranko Radovanovic** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 10:18 am

Corky, i would follow the rules.
They are published and for everyone the same. Follow this line makes the slalomranking believable.

If you make here an exception than will the next question be why you didn't make an exception in the US with the canceled race. For your view, perhaps it isn't a big exception because of one day to late, for other people it can look like a big exception.

My proposal for this situation:
SWE and UK should be preferred for the two last Primes.
make them a deadline when they have at least to announce their races. If they don't announce anything until the deadline, than give the statuses to the other candidates away.

The deadline for the nomination of the ISSA representatives will be finished in the end of this month. The ranking is an important Topic and it will be discussed and worked on the guidlines.

/J-Rad

Donald Campbell · Post by **Donald Campbell** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 12:29 pm

this is getting ridiculous.

ok,corky here's why i protest:
peter had his fingers a long time ago on the prime-he should get it.

jadranko is doing a contest in the same region 2 times a year-the same region means,that there are only 20-30 kms distance from grüningen and zürich.
that's a bit too close for my taste and i think for each and everybody's taste,especially ifj-rad would go by the "holy bible",he would see that this definitely is an unfair advantage.

brands hatch should be also mentioned.our friends are still trying to pull off a bigger race this season and they should see some support.

yes,we would like to have the prime,but we don't need it to make this race happen.
actually we qualified for the prime soon enough and the change of location has been made in favor of the audience,which is even more appealing to what the "organizing body" wants to see.

j-rad should only get one prime this year,anything else will be unfair to the rest in europe,who is trying to get some good races started.
otherwise,we will announce 2 big races next season,with money and sponsors and then it will be even tougher to decide who gets what.the races would be in the same areas we have this year,btw.
since the great western race is a event happening 2 times a year,we should actually get at least one prime,that's how i see it.

again:each race good enough should qualify for a prime-make the system more flexible.

if not,ok your thing....but i am completely against j-rad reaping all the benefits for his events-the reasons are obvious.the only thing i see in his posts is trying to make his interpretation of the system work for him.
also noteworthy is the explanation that most of the racers visiting grüningen do not travel and are in need of a few points.ridiculous,if you ask me.
check the top 10 and see how many racers were in there who travel quite a lot,or is airflow and indiana a brand of guys who don't go to other contests?
stupid question,but the answer bears the truth.

all this drama is really annoying and i am not doing an event in order to get some points from the ranking,but i am not willing to let things go that easily,when i see somebody trying to snake himself into the system,trying to use it for his own advantage.
as long as i see this feud without a resolution,you will have me objecting against your second prime status.
it's not against the race-you know that.

Peter Klang · Post by **Peter Klang** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:43 pm

OK let me say this ones and for all.
I don´t care if Stockholm will get prime, Main or major status this year, the event will be big anyway. What I do care about is that at least one Prime will be in late august or early september, we need a race between Brixlegg and Antibes, that´s all.

London would be da bomb.

Yo
PK

Mike Cividino · Post by **Mike Cividino** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:54 pm

J-rad, you say you have info online for your race but it is all in swiss german....how is the rest of the world supposed to know whats going on?. Please translate your page, more english cabable people than swiss german into slalom. Thank you.

EDIT: thanks ramon.

Ramón Königshausen · Post by **Ramón Königshausen** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:14 pm

At the top on the right side you've got some flags like the British or the Amarican...click on them and you get the main information in your language. http://www.pscontest.ch/index.do/news_show.html?lang=en

rmn

Ramón Königshausen · Post by **Ramón Königshausen** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 5:27 pm

Donald Campbell wrote:j-rad should only get one prime this year,anything else will be unfair to the rest in europe,who is trying to get some good races started.

Actually it's not J-Rad who gets the status, it's the Swiss scene that deserves the status. Since we've got a very strong & connected scene [...], I think J-Rad is right about the fact that we'd deserve at least 2 Prime "because" we haven't got a Main Status for this year.
But anyway...I don't care too much about those statuses - do what you want...

rmn

Mike Cividino · Post by **Mike Cividino** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:14 pm

I think the issue about 2 primes in the same area that is the problem. Personally I dont think it should be a big deal if you dont get 2 primes in Zurich and Grunni, just travel a little to another race. Consider yourselves very lucky to have such short distances to travel to races.

I wish we had your problem over here. How about Canada? We're 5000 km from coast to coast, and we get 2 statues races. Switzerland could fit in my backyard. Space it out for the euros a bit.

Just my opinion.

Ramón Königshausen · Post by **Ramón Königshausen** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:43 pm

Mike Cividino wrote: Switzerland could fit in my backyard.

Hum, okay. In that point you're completely right. I also told J-Rad that those races are too close to each other and the rest of tiny Switzerland would also like to hold races in their region. And of course it isn't a problem at all to travel around here, not only if you look at the distances, our infrastructure is just killer too!

So I'd say: bad luck J-Rad, you've chosen your locations too close to each other. What about Thun, Chur or Lausanne?
Okay J-Rad, you might try to counter (since we've had that discussion before, I can guess how you'd respond): It's the first time you're organizing a racing serie and you don't want to make it become too big at the beginning to look how it turns out etc.; sort of trial. I accept that agument but then, now it's your turn, you should also accept that you might not get 2 Prime Statuses this year. That's the price you got to pay...

rmn

Steve Hinzen · Post by **Steve Hinzen** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:48 pm

Hans Koraeus wrote:
This means that all the Primes are gone for this season but... why not.

Any protest on this?

Corky, I don't agree on that.
Düsseldorf in April will be a great season opener. Corky, you took a decision on that before and beside our protests we had to arrange things quickly around that. So there is no turning back for us to a prime. Corky, If I would have posted such a "verdict", I would have curiously obeserved the reactions on this forum...sorry, but your latest proposal comes too late.

In the meantime I've learned from our Mastermind Jadranko that we all have to follow those damn rules. Wow! Strong words!
Anyway, there are 2 simple criterias Corky set up which make really sense to me:
spread the events out geographically and periodically.

Conclusion:
Stockholm in August is a lot more qualified for a prime contest than Zurich.
I don't have to explain why.
But Stockholm gets a prime and wins it over Zurich for another reason. This year the Swiss scene is gifted by beeing situated closer to the World Championships than anybody else. The road distance Zurich-Brixlegg is 326 km, which means a 3.50 hours drive.

Comes the question about the second prime:
with our proposal of Düsseldorf as a backup for a prime at the end of the season, Corky and everybody else can take it easy by waiting for other proposals fullfilling those 2 criterias I mentioned in the beginning.

The future looks bright, eh?!

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:33 pm

Funny how you have to tweak arms to get some action.

Notice that I wrote "Any protests on this?"

Now this is how it should be. People speaking up for what they belive in, for and against different actions. The two remaining Prime statuses are up in the air again.

At least we can now agree that Dusseldorf April 2 don't get one of the two remaining Prime statuses for 2006.

Current Candidates for the two last Primes 2006
- Stockholm, SWE | | August?
- Zürich, SUI | Swiss Slalom Series #4 Final | September 24
- Dusseldorf, GER | Great Western Race Series #2 | October 8

Join the ISSA 25 cone series. One cyber race every second month!

Regular sessions allow newbies to join our community and discover slalom racing.

[2006] Region East Atlantic: Europe

asking for status

Re: asking for status

GWRS / ranking status

GWRS goes off anyway!

stop !

The process does seem a bit messed up

looking forward

our scene

My suggestion:

webusers' unability

Stockholm and... ?Düsseldorf?