European Championships - June 4-6 2010 - Richterswil, SUI

[Ramón Königshausen]

It's about time I give you some more information as things are really starting to roll here.

We hope to have most information as well as the registration up in 1-2 weeks.


Location

There's a little change in location as the event is not held IN Zurich anymore but in its suburbs at about 25km from Zurich (easily reachable by public transit - there's a direct train form the airport to Richterswil. The S2 that is.).

For those among you who attended the GS of the Tunnel Slalom, you know the aera.

Note that Richterswil is my hometown

Accommodation

So most important, if you haven't already booked your hotel try to get into Richterswil's youth hostel.


http://www.youthhostel.ch/hosteldetails ... 9ee2bbe2f4


Venue

The venue will be located in the centre of Richterswil with surrounding restaurants and a couple bars. It is also close to the lake side as well as the youth hostel.

The road was repaved about 4 years ago and has a good inclination (compares to Brixlegg TS venue or Jurmala, both in 2006..

Photos and map will follow.


Entry fee

AM/WOM: roughly €40-60
PRO: roughly €80-110
JUN: roughly €30-50

Note that these numbers are subject to change.



We will provide you with as much information as soon as possible.

thanks,

Ramón

[Gints Gailitis]

It is great that the details of the EM!
Unfortunately, cheap airBaltic flights to Zurich are no longer available.
Flights to the transit does not look good.

Only 2 participants from the Latvian bought tickets to the EM. Both EM 2009 champions!
Entry fee, I think, does not that will be even more riders from the Latvian.

[Jani Soderhall]

Entry fee

AM/WOM: roughly €40-60
PRO: roughly €80-110
JUN: roughly €30-50

Note that these numbers are subject to change.

How about changing the ladies to FREE and Juniors to 20-30? (Depends on what is in the package, ie meals and t-shirts, etc). We need to encourage these two categories. If there would be a KIDS (under 12) category I think it should always be FREE. (But maybe the EC is not really where kids race.)

For the pro fee, I was hoping there would be a trend towards a lower entry fee. There has been so many complaints about it, but unfortunately you don't seem to support that idea.

Wishing you all a great race!

/Jani

[Jani Soderhall]

Entry fee

AM/WOM: roughly €40-60
PRO: roughly €80-110
JUN: roughly €30-50

Note that these numbers are subject to change.

How about changing the ladies to FREE and Juniors to 20-30? (Depends on what is in the package, ie meals and t-shirts, etc). We need to encourage these two categories. If there would be a KIDS (under 12) category I think it should always be FREE. (But maybe the EC is not really where kids race.)

For the pro fee, I was hoping there would be a trend towards a lower entry fee. There has been so many complaints about it, but unfortunately you don't seem to support that idea.

Wishing you all a great race!

/Jani

[Jani Soderhall]

AM/WOM: roughly €40-60
PRO: roughly €80-110
JUN: roughly €30-50

How about changing the ladies to FREE and Juniors to 20-30? (of course it also depends on what is in the package, ie meals and t-shirts, etc). But the point is we need to encourage these two categories. If there would be a KIDS (under 12) category I think it should always be FREE. (But maybe the EC is not really where kids race.)

For the PRO fee, I was hoping there would be a trend towards a lower entry fee. There has been so many complaints about it, but unfortunately you don't seem to support that idea.

Also, how does the PRO/AM separation suit the new ISSA 2010 rules. Are they valid right away, or can race organizers do it any way they want. Maybe those rules were put into action just a little bit too quickly, with race organizers not ready for the change, but at the same time I have already heard AMs being pleased with this merged class.

/Jani

[Josef Stefka]

Ramon :

Accommodation
So most important, if you haven't already booked your hotel try to get into Richterswil's youth hostel.
None of the hostels listed at the bottom of the page can be booked online for the date entered.


Is there some another accommodation near?

[Ramón Königshausen]

AM/WOM: roughly €40-60
PRO: roughly €80-110
JUN: roughly €30-50

How about changing the ladies to FREE and Juniors to 20-30? (of course it also depends on what is in the package, ie meals and t-shirts, etc). But the point is we need to encourage these two categories. If there would be a KIDS (under 12) category I think it should always be FREE. (But maybe the EC is not really where kids race.)

For the PRO fee, I was hoping there would be a trend towards a lower entry fee. There has been so many complaints about it, but unfortunately you don't seem to support that idea.

Also, how does the PRO/AM separation suit the new ISSA 2010 rules. Are they valid right away, or can race organizers do it any way they want. Maybe those rules were put into action just a little bit too quickly, with race organizers not ready for the change, but at the same time I have already heard AMs being pleased with this merged class.

/Jani

Yep, moving the ladies to at least JUN fee and try to keep that as low as possible.


As for now the exact amount of entry fee has not been set. We've paid more before. We tried to set a trend in 2009 by offering a PRO entry fee of a mere €50 and 30 for AM. However, none of the big events in 2009 followed that trend. 2010 doesn't seem to be much different. We would love to see a trend happening and tried to start it last year. This year is looking a bit different so we just try and go by the "guidelines".

So yes, I do and have been supporting that idea ever since I've been a racer and tried to adopt to it turning into an event organizer but it doesn't seem like many events can actually afford lower entry fees.



As for the rules they kind of got changed during the whole process of event sanctioning etc. We are still under the impression that the statuses of this year ought to be run under the old status sanctioning rules. However, if it is asked for, they may be applied the new rules. (To me they're more of a cosmetic change - that does make sense - rather than an actual organizational change that affects the riders.)

On a side note: "at the same time I have already heard AMs being pleased with this merged class."

Has anyone ever answered my question about what's gonna happen to TS if classes are merged?


Anyway, quoting the rules, the PRO division does still exist:

9. Racer Classifications, Racer Groupings, Awards, AND Overall Winner
9.1 Racer Classifications
The following racer classifications are recognized. Not every contest will award points, prizes, and
medals to every one of these classifications. A racer must race in one and only one classification
for each race.
• Open: Every racer may race in the “open” classification.
• Skill level (self declared grouping):
• Pro / Amateur
• Gender
• Female / Male
• Age:
• Juniors: (17 and under) racers who’s age will not reach 18 in the current year.
• Teens: (14 and under) those racers who’s age will not reach 15 in the current year.
• Kids: (11 and under) those racers who’s age will not reach 12 in the current year.
• Masters: Those racers who’s age is 45 years or older.

Accommodation

For those who have asked for accommodation advice: Due to the Iron Man event in Rapperswil on Sunday, the youth hostel in Richterswil is almost booked (5-6 2-bed rooms for Fri-Sat and 1 4-bed room for Fri-Sat)

There is another youth hostel in Zurich Wollishofen as well as some B&B in the area.

http://www.hri.ch/8805-Drei-K%C3%B6nige

http://www.tripadvisor.de/Hotel_Review- ... urich.html

http://www.youthhostel.ch/index.php?id= ... 0f6b2d2c9c

http://www.dulac-waedenswil.ch/en/i_hotel.htm

My recommendation:
http://www.cantinateresa.ch/page/index. ... NavID=2526


I will also check if we could offer free camping.

rmn

[Josef Stefka]

Thanks Ramon.
..and i agree with you Statuses for this year are set. Only Brixlegg ?

[Michel Dupont]

Thanks Ramon.
..and i agree with you Statuses for this year are set. Only Brixlegg ?

Josef, does this men that the men's category in the world's is divided into pro and am category?

[Sam Gordon]

Hi Ramon,
Is there any guide as to the breakdown of the schedule as yet? Might have to be somewhere in UK on Friday, so would like to know what'll be missed.
Blimmin' arrangements an' t'ing!

Cheers,

Sam


Thanks for the reply below, Raymondo!

I'm now booked on the super early Saturday morning flight and will be heading back on Sunday evening.

Come on English pigs, sign up and take part!!!

[Ramón Königshausen]

The quick answer:

Fri: HS - full day
Sat: TS - full day
Sun: GS - 3/4 of a day or so...

Starting no later than 9/9:30 a.m.


rmn

[Janis kuzmins]

Hi Ramon,
Lienīte and me book the tickets to plain pretty early when the previos info was about two days competition. Our plain arrives Friday at 13.00.! We are intrested in competing on all three events.

[Ramón Königshausen]

Hi Ramon,
Lienīte and me book the tickets to plain pretty early when the previos info was about two days competition. Our plain arrives Friday at 13.00.! We are intrested in competing on all three events.

Hello Janis,

where did you read that it was two days?


rmn

[Janis kuzmins]

Not sure, that there was some quite straight info-but we booked the tickets few months ago. You know for coming to Zurich, there need to plan flight before. Now it's 24 of April and there are no schedule FOR competition but price for flights come up every day.
Info are coming not so fast on Forum and changing pretty often (location...). Before this week info about starting time Friday at 9.00 -9.30, coming at race track in Zurich on 14-still did look posible for competing.
I think we will be not the only ones Europeans who will come on Friday-Think about Friday -possibility - half of day and GS. Not bad for everybody. Its EC! Main days for head to head races is always Saturday and Sunday. On my mind for good loking EC organisers need to be interested in more riders, more countries, more competitive races.
Anyhow-still miss the schedule and corrections are not to late- and we want to compete. Thats all.

[Donald Campbell]

hey,sorry to chime in here,but i think something's completely wrong here.

please...please...keep in mind that i really do NOt want to make anybody's life here miserable or torpedoing an event.

in all seriousness i want to ask this question and i do hope that anybody will understand my concerns:

how come that a seemingly good event is moving to another location and then becoming a 1 day show which is called euro-championships?


i bet the title has been awarded under different aspects and i also bet that the event now would not have been rewarded such a sanction.

shouldn't we throw the euros into another direction than switzerland under these bad circumstances?

i really don't know too much of the event in question,but i'm starting to wonder a bit about it and i also want to express my concerns about this situation.

if you think i see things the wrong way,please carry on and make it the best possible.

ramonski,honestly no offense meant,i worry a bit though,ok?


please note that i am excusing and questioning myself in almost every sentence,so you might get the very polite drift!

[Ramón Königshausen]

Not sure, that there was some quite straight info-but we booked the tickets few months ago. You know for coming to Zurich, there need to plan flight before. Now it's 24 of April and there are no schedule FOR competition but price for flights come up every day.
Info are coming not so fast on Forum and changing pretty often (location...). Before this week info about starting time Friday at 9.00 -9.30, coming at race track in Zurich on 14-still did look posible for competing.
I think we will be not the only ones Europeans who will come on Friday-Think about Friday -possibility - half of day and GS. Not bad for everybody. Its EC! Main days for head to head races is always Saturday and Sunday. On my mind for good loking EC organisers need to be interested in more riders, more countries, more competitive races.
Anyhow-still miss the schedule and corrections are not to late- and we want to compete. Thats all.

I get your point.

The thing is we cannot run the GS on Friday due to road closure abilities. If you want we can start 2hrs late but then will have to face that daylight and spectators will be gone once we're getting close to the end.

I can post a full schedule by Monday night.


rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

how come that a seemingly good event is moving to another location and then becoming a 1 day show which is called euro-championships?

One-day show – what are you talking about? The topic clearly says "June 4-6". The move to a different location does not change much at all. It actually helps the event gain more quality.

i bet the title has been awarded under different aspects and i also bet that the event now would not have been rewarded such a sanction.

shouldn't we throw the euros into another direction than switzerland under these bad circumstances?

i really don't know too much of the event in question,but i'm starting to wonder a bit about it and i also want to express my concerns about this situation.

if you think i see things the wrong way,please carry on and make it the best possible.

ramonski,honestly no offense meant,i worry a bit though,ok?


please note that i am excusing and questioning myself in almost every sentence,so you might get the very polite drift!

Yes I get your point and there IS a lack of information which does not mean there is nothing going on. It depends on what peoples expectations are.

If anyone feels like we should not hold the Euro Champs anymore because they fear a lack in quality...well then I don't know. For me most important is that there is an event happening as opposed to having no event at all.

Let's talk about it when I fed you with more info Monday night.


thanks

rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

I can give you a better answer Janis:

Pro and Women won't race until noon on Friday.

rmn

[Donald Campbell]

know what?
i misinterpreted one of your sentences ramon.
rechecked the whole thing and yes it's 3 days?
am i right?
forget what i said,nobody cared anyway...

[Ramón Königshausen]

Huh okay maybe it wasn't clear. Sorry for that.

It's hard to make a good guess of what and how people want things to happen. I know we're late with info. Next week the registration, schedule, and additional info will be on www.burningwheelstour.ch


rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

Rough Schedule detailed schedule will be published on our website




Friday - Hybrid

08:10-08:50
Confirmation of online registration, starting number assignment, pre-training

09:10-15:50
Amateur + Juniors + Women Racing (in that order)

16:10 - 21:50
Pro Racing




Saturday - Tight


08:10-14:50
Amateur + Juniors + Women Racing (in that order)


15:10 - 21:50
Pro Racing




Sunday - Giant



09:00-11:00
Open GS practice

11:00 - 17:00
Open Racing

17:30 Awards + BBQ


Pros please note to be ready at least one hour prior to racing time!




Accommodation update

Limited camping will be available. (You'll be able to tick it off on your registration or send an e-mail directly to me)


rmn

[Janis kuzmins]

Ramon,

Thank you w.m!
I see you made it posible for me.

How much time aproximateley takes going from airport to race track?
Its posible to give a last racing number in JUN.AM.WOM category for Lienīte?

[Ramón Königshausen]

Janis,

that's why I put the ladies after everyone else and in front of the Pros since I knew Lienite is travelling with you.

If you take the direct train service (S2) it'll take you exactly 45 minutes from Zurich Airport to Richterswil. The train leaves '51 and '20 every hour. However, there are more connections that require changing trains.


rmn

[Stefano Bellingeri]

By reading the new rules I understood that there will be only one category Open (Pro+Am together), so I wonder what will be the right schedule. Am I right?
Thanks,
Stefano

[Ramón Königshausen]

If that is the case it would severely mess up the schedule indeed. As I posted earlier, the 2010 rules still state that there is a separate Pro and Am category.

Honestly I wouldn't know what to do if we had to run the Tight Slalom Open Class. But sadly it looks like real TS will be dead. Good I made the transition over to DH just in time


rmn

[Michel Dupont]

If that is the case it would severely mess up the schedule indeed. As I posted earlier, the 2010 rules still state that there is a separate Pro and Am category.

Honestly I wouldn't know what to do if we had to run the Tight Slalom Open Class. But sadly it looks like real TS will be dead. Good I made the transition over to DH just in time


rmn

One way or the other, would it not be good if the main competions in Europe this year would all be held the same way?

[Jani Soderhall]

One way or the other, would it not be good if the main competions in Europe this year would all be held the same way?

Yes that would be ideal.

- Grenoble is in favor of Open class and has already adopted that change of the rules.
- Worlds I guess will have to follow the ISSA rules, and they seem to insist that the rules are valid as of now.
- Euros, well, Ramon has already moved on to downhill, he should not really care.

Ramon, Klang, Dominik: What do you think and which are the big events this year?

/Jani

[Petr Janousek]

Good I made the transition over to DH just in time


rmn

Good luck Ramón.

[Petr Janousek]

Yes that would be ideal.

- Grenoble is in favor of Open class and has already adopted that change of the rules.
- Worlds I guess will have to follow the ISSA rules, and they seem to insist that the rules are valid as of now.
- Euros, well, Ramon has already moved on to downhill, he should not really care.

Ramon, Klang, Dominik: What do you think and which are the big events this year?

/Jani

The World Championship in Czech Republic will be OPEN (AM+PRO together).
What about Brixlegg? How will be points calculated into the world rankings?

[Donald Campbell]

the brixlegg issa race is an open race and will have the same point value as the worlds.

[Petr Janousek]

the brixlegg issa race is an open race and will have the same point value as the worlds.

Donald, the Brixlegg will has races for invited races and for non invited races (contests). All the "invitee racers" will not compete in the race (contest) for the "non invitee". All the "non invitee racers" will not compete in the race for the "invitee"...
Still I'm not sure how they assign points. Brixlegg don´t have the "classic" open race...

[Donald Campbell]

let the issa guys figure that out
also,there are people out there who go to a race regardless of points.
it's about good racing and having fun,an aspect not to be forgotten.
some people tend to though
also you should carefully read what i wrote about brixlegg before you pass on wrong information.
you can find it here on this site.
take your time...

[Petr Janousek]

Yes, Donald, I agree with you. It's about good racing and having fun... I don´t have anything about you or Brixlegg... I want when BOD ISSA has said "A" that BOD ISSA will say "B" . "A"= change statuses. "B"= change rules and world rankings. It is all.

[Ramón Königshausen]

One way or the other, would it not be good if the main competions in Europe this year would all be held the same way?

Yes that would be ideal.

- Grenoble is in favor of Open class and has already adopted that change of the rules.
- Worlds I guess will have to follow the ISSA rules, and they seem to insist that the rules are valid as of now.
- Euros, well, Ramon has already moved on to downhill, he should not really care.

Ramon, Klang, Dominik: What do you think and which are the big events this year?

/Jani

Okay guys. Looks like I have to give in here right? If we change to Open class that would have a change of schedule as a consequence, I know at least two people who wouldn't favor that (Janis and Lienite that is). But on the other hand, it would really help the event flow and time management.

Still, I don't know how I would handle TS. Really don't know. I mean, HOW? How can you ask for a TS that feels like a TS to both the best Pros and the biggest greenhorn in the event? HOW?


rmn


PS: A test version of our inscription tool is up. As soon as I approved it, I will post the link here. Sorry for the delay. We've had some data base issues with our homepage.

[Pat Chewning]

Still, I don't know how I would handle TS. Really don't know. I mean, HOW? How can you ask for a TS that feels like a TS to both the best Pros and the biggest greenhorn in the event? HOW?


rmn

I have a suggestion:

You run OPEN class in TS. However, you have 2 courses -- the "ADVANCED" course and the "NORMAL" course. Participants may choose one or the other. The final results for the OPEN class in TS are ordered like this:

1) Placings in the ADVANCED course.
2) PLacings in the NORMAL course.
3) DQ's in Qualifying the ADVANCED course.
4) DQ's in Qualifying the NORMAL course.

Still all one OPEN class, but run on two different courses for the benefit of challenging the best racers on one course and allowing the other racers to hopefully finish on the other course.

We do this at the Oregon State Games, but since our TS is single-lane we alter this a bit and allow racers to try both courses, with their best finish putting them into the standings. For your H2H race, I think you will need to have the racers choose a course and stick with it.


PS: This only works well when there is a significant difference in the courses -- i.e. an ADVANCED course so challenging that even some who elect to race in it will DQ.

[Petr Janousek]

Still, I don't know how I would handle TS. Really don't know. I mean, HOW? How can you ask for a TS that feels like a TS to both the best Pros and the biggest greenhorn in the event? HOW?


rmn

It´s easy for me...
The race with status Basic (Level 4) is designed for all riders (beginner and advanced). It is expected that the slalom will be easier (distance 1.8 to 2.5 m) here.
The race with status Major (Level 1) is designed for advanced riders. It is expected that the slalom will be harder (distance 1.5 to 1.8 m) here. The beginner can not expect to succeed on the type of race World Championship or European Championships...

The problem of slalom skateboarding is a small number of riders. When 1000 active riders will race in each country it will be necessary to establish qualifications for World and European Championships... then come to these events the best of the best. Nobody will ask if organizer built the easier slalom or the harder slalom. The harder slalom will be built automatically.
The current situation is: When 30 or 40 riders attend the contest it's a "big" race. The organizers attract riders to various benefits (free food and drinks, t-shirts, free entry to the party, prize money ...) and the organizers are pleased when someone arrives. Let alone that they can choose ...
I thing that the harder slalom should be built in the European and World Championship .

[Guillaume Saint-Criq]

Open class is a + in the 2010 rules (even if it can mean there will not be any WorldRanking for a long time, considering all the work it will need...), and we must keep TS hard in higher status races.
Racers can expect something near the low limit for bigger races -WC, EC or Worlds - (NB : ISSA 2010 Cone Spacing Suggestion: 1.5m to 2.5m).
Then, it will automatically encourage racer who can't make it in a high status race to take part in lower ones... It can trend to more local races, better/harder main races...

[Petr Janousek]

Yes Guillaume, It is the same idea which I wrote... EC or WC = harder slaloms.

[Ramón Königshausen]

Okay guys, I guess you've convinced me and the option of offering a harder and less hard course makes it much more understandable for me.

Now I just have to figure out the entry fee.

Right now we have €60 AM / €90 Pro so the logical consequence for Open would be €75. What do you think?

I need to know soon for inscription purposes and calculation of budget.

rmn

[Petr Janousek]

The entry fee to the World Championship is 100 EUR. The entry fee to Brixlegg is 150 EUR. Then entry fee for the European Championship of 75 EUR is not high. The boys from Latvia and Lithuania will not agree with me. They aren´t willing to pay more than 50 EUR ...

[Guillaume Saint-Criq]

of course it (also) depends on what is in the package, ie meals and t-shirts, etc

Good to know you will make it open, and tight ... i am sure we will be able to deal a qualification slot for those who have a late landing...

[Michel Dupont]

Now I just have to figure out the entry fee.

Right now we have €60 AM / €90 Pro so the logical consequence for Open would be €75. What do you think?

rmn

75 € might seem expensive but with Brixlegg at 150 € and WC at 100 €, 75 € is very reasonable, after all it is an European Championship race.

[Ramón Königshausen]

Registration and general info is up:

http://burningwheelstour.ch/contentD/em2010EN.php


rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

Location Friday:

http://tinyurl.com/38cykby


Location Saturday:

http://tinyurl.com/35uosr3


Location Sunday:

http://tinyurl.com/38v7dqx


rmn

[Ramón Königshausen]

Follow the live results:

http://worldcupranking.com/live/index.asp



Today's HS:

1st Ramón Königshausen
2nd Dominik Kowalski
3rd Thiago Gardenal
4th Pascal Weber


WOM

1st Kathrin Sehl
2nd Lea Gasser
3rd Helen Zimmermann


JUN

1st Marc Steinemann
2nd Philipp Enzmann
3rd Julian Roth


rmn

[Ansis Rudzats]

as I undestand Janis Kuzmins & Lienite Skaraine didn't get in time for the race or they started so badly?

[Márcio Benevides]

Ohhhhhhh... Nice!! Way to go, Gardenal!! Awesome!!


Congrats to all the riders!!

[Donald Campbell]

yippiieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Jani Soderhall]

as I undestand Janis Kuzmins & Lienite Skaraine didn't get in time for the race or they started so badly?

I checked the top 16 and couldn't see Janis there, so Yes, I assume they didn't make it in time.

/Jani